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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Fuel tank?   Mon May 01, 2017 7:33 pm

Well I just got some hard news to swallow. My new-to-me wagon ('93 Caprice) has a vapor leak at/near the top of the fuel tank. Not actually leaking fuel, but the vapor leak prevents me from getting the car registered in CA.
Anyone have a lead on where I can find a new one?
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silverfox103
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Mon May 01, 2017 8:31 pm

There is a metal vent line coming from the sending unit on top of the tank. On the end of the vent tube there is a rubber hose which connects to a metal line. It's possible that the rubber hose could have come disconnected or being 25 years old it could be deteriorated.

Tom
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TheRoadmasterKing

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Mon May 01, 2017 8:42 pm

So glad I don't live in California. I couldn't put up with all their emissions crap. Surprised they don't have the doctors make Californians take breathing tests for carbon dioxide emissions Laughing
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lakeffect
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Mon May 01, 2017 9:04 pm

Where the pipe enters at the metal cover the material cracks and leaks air accordingly. Drop the tank.
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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 12:45 am

Thanks everyone. New info I learned this evening. Tank was dropped and evidently the leak is somewhere at the top of the tank itself. Sorry, I didn't know this part earlier.  It also appears someone made an attempt to fix this with epoxy.  Are these tanks really obsolete now?
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silverfox103
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 9:02 am

Not obsolete, but getting harder to find. Any that are at junkyards, have holes put in them in them to drain the gas. Best bet is to find someone parting one out. The "BUICKNUTT", a forum member in your state of CA someplace, always has wagons that he is parting.

Tom
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lakeffect
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 9:22 am

If it is still out, get a new rubber ring to replace the seal between the tank and sender plate. Also replace the hose going from the pump to the underside of the outlet plate
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Fred Kiehl

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 9:52 am

Check with BUICKNUTT. He may have some tanks, and is probably the closest to you. All year wagon tanks are interchangeable. http://gmlongroof.4umer.com/t9886-the-roadmaster-farm-parting-out-6-buick-wagons-1-1991-2-1993-s-2-1996-more-parts-from-previous-parting-outs

The tanks are not repairable to the best of my knowledge.

I just sold my spare tank to a friend locally. They are extremely hard to come by.
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81X11

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 10:13 am

TheRoadmasterKing wrote:
So glad I don't live in California. I couldn't put up with all their emissions crap. Surprised they don't have the doctors make Californians take breathing tests for carbon dioxide emissions Laughing

AMEN! God Bless TEXAS! I couldn't put up with that crap. These are 20+ year old cars! Insane! Rolling Eyes
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81X11

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 10:23 am

You might check Rock Auto. Also see if Spectra makes the tank. I got a Spectra tank from Rock Auto for my '82 Camaro.

Good Luck!

-Mike
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Fred Kiehl

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 10:31 am

Save your time and effort, nobody makes an aftermarket tank.
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Rev Bob



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 11:45 am

""Save your time and effort, nobody makes an aftermarket tank.""

(for the wagons), (my addition)

Yup.

If you locate someone who does, please share.
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81X11

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 11:57 am

Glide-Aways have you tried looking for a used one near you? Check http://www.car-part.com/ and also search vehicles on http://row52.com/ . Might get lucky!

There's also always Ebay! Hope you find one,

-Mike
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81X11

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 12:00 pm

No idea how close this is to you, but here is someone parting out a TBI Roadmaster wagon in California. https://inlandempire.craigslist.org/pts/6016375189.html

The 91-93 Caprice, Roadmaster, and 91-92 Custom Cruiser should have the same tanks. Others can chime in here if the 94-96 are the same.
-Mike
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Fred Kiehl

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 12:23 pm

I already posted that they are the interchangeable.
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81X11

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 02, 2017 12:46 pm

Fred Kiehl wrote:
I already posted that they are the interchangeable.

Missed that Fred. Good to know!
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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 03, 2017 12:52 am

Hi everyone and thanks for the tips!! I just got home and am reading this. This afternoon, I stumbled upon O'Reilly Auto Parts and they claim to have a new one, made by "Doorman" (spelling?). Is this believable? I tried a half dozen other well known auto parts sources who had nothing.
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Rev Bob



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 03, 2017 6:56 am

""Is this believable?""

Nope.
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lakeffect
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 03, 2017 7:25 am

Does anyone know if the sedan tanks and wagon tanks are identical? I know the sending units are slightly difference in the shape and position off the sending tubes.

The sedan tubes are shorter and straight, where as the wagon tubes are longer and dog leg off to the right of center.

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Fred Kiehl

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 03, 2017 9:16 am

The sedan tanks are completely different. They have the filler enter at the center rear, while the wagon tank has the filler enter on the side. Totally NOT compatible.

I checked the O'Reilly's site, and they do not have a tank for either the wagon or sedan.

I also checked Dorman's site, and they do not list a fuel tank for either wagon or sedan.
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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 03, 2017 10:43 am

Yeah, I've had zero luck searching sites, so yesterday I started calling some of the most well-known suppliers; O'Reilly was the only one who said they had it.

I just emailed buicknutt to see if he might have one.

Thanks everyone. I'll keep you posted.
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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 03, 2017 10:46 am

Thanks Mike! I'll check out those links later today. Fingers crossed!
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Sprocket

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 09, 2017 4:14 pm

Unless the plastic tank itself is cracked, a new sending unit should fix the issue and they are available new. I just bought a spectra one with a fuel pump for about 90 bucks....

Be Aware the sending units for a wagon are DIFFERENT than a sedan (metal tubes are longer on one of them)
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 09, 2017 4:20 pm

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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 09, 2017 4:28 pm

Thanks Sprocket. Yes, the tank itself is cracked on the top side. I was having a diagnostic done on the entire evap system which took us right to the tank. When it was lowered, the crack on the top side was discovered. I'm not actually leaking fuel, but I can smell gasoline when the tank is completely full.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 09, 2017 4:31 pm

It may be possible to "weld" the tank with the proper plastic filler rod, and a "plastic welding" tool. No flame is used, but the tank should be properly cleaned for the procedure.
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lamune

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Tue May 09, 2017 10:38 pm

Fred Kiehl wrote:
It may be possible to "weld" the tank with the proper plastic filler rod, and a "plastic welding" tool. No flame is used, but the tank should be properly cleaned for the procedure.

If it's polypropylene that should work very well.
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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 10, 2017 11:09 am

Well, I'm almost out of options. I've spent time calling around looking for tank repair places but nobody wants to touch (repair) a plastic tank. You (collectively) were right in that finding a new replacement is near-impossible. I'm about to start calling a few salvage yards that advertise having one to see if they don't have holes in them. "Buicknutt" and I have been emailing and it seems he may have one from a Roadmaster, but dialogue remains in-progress and so far inconclusive.

I've taken risks on wagon purchases in the past, but it appears this time I may have lost. Without a tank replacement, I'll be forced to sell. It's such a shame. This wagon is otherwise a great ride and in great shape. Thanks again for your advice; will keep you posted.
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silverfox103
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 10, 2017 1:23 pm

Be patient, there are plenty of parts hoarders that have them. Keep looking.

Tom
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 10, 2017 1:34 pm

Glide-Aways wrote:
Well, I'm almost out of options.  I've spent time calling around looking for tank repair places but nobody wants to touch (repair) a plastic tank.  You (collectively) were right in that finding a new replacement is near-impossible.  I'm about to start calling a few salvage yards that advertise having one to see if they don't have holes in them.  "Buicknutt" and I have been emailing and it seems he may have one from a Roadmaster, but dialogue remains in-progress and so far inconclusive.  

I've taken risks on wagon purchases in the past, but it appears this time I may have lost.  Without a tank replacement, I'll be forced to sell. It's such a shame. This wagon is otherwise a great ride and in great shape.  Thanks again for your advice; will keep you posted.

Wait, take a breath and step back. There are still a TON of these cars out there, and I'm sure by going to Used Parts on Craigslist, and also looking through the salvage yard searches like Route 52 (http://row52.com/Search ) and Car-Part.com (http://www.car-part.com/), and Ebay of course, that you can locate a good tank.
Heck being a plastic tank, if this was my car, I'd just drop the tank and use one of the over-counter repair kits like BLUE MAGIC plastic tank repair kit (http://www.autozone.com/sealants-glues-adhesives-and-tape/specialty-repair/blue-magic-quiksteel-plastic-tank-repair-kit/344797_0_0 ) for now . Those fix-it-kits MAY not last forever, but will get you through inspection, and then for the next year you can keep an eye on Ebay for an NOS tank to pop up, which they do, and enjoy your car! There are a lot of YouTube videos on how to repair plastic tanks as well.


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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 10, 2017 1:45 pm

Parts Search #1 https://www.partshotlines.com/parts/buick/roadmaster/fuel-tank.html - LOTS listed here.

FROM Car-Part.com

1996
Fuel Tank Assembly
Buick Roadmaster 4SW,LTD.,5.7,RWD 205 Auto Salvage USA-OR(Portland) 800-336-2562

1993
Fuel Tank Assembly
Chevy Caprice SW Highland Auto Parts USA (Nevada) 888-457-2657/ 417-667-7000

1995
Fuel Tank Assembly
Buick Roadmaster 5.7L,RWD $75 Twin Lakes Auto Salvage USA-TX(Dallas) 1-972-225-4536 / 1-800-891-4536

1993
Fuel Tank Assembly
Buick Roadmaster 5.7L,RWD $75 Twin Lakes Auto Salvage USA-TX(Dallas) 1-972-225-4536 / 1-800-891-4536

Many more listed.

This is not a needle-in-a-haystack item. I just found all those in 5-mins. More listed on Car-Part.com, and did not even search Row 52.

Wait until you have to find a good non-cracked driver's side door panel or a perfect late-95-96 center arm rest lid. Then I'll cry along with you. Wink

Take Care!

-Mike
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Wed May 10, 2017 1:56 pm

This is going to continue to be an issue with these cars.  HPDE is a great material for this but over time (10-15 years) it does get brittle and tends to crack along stress lines.  You can repair it but don't use any of the epoxy based glues as they are ridged and don't expand and contract like the original material.  Short term fix only.

The only way to do this properly is to weld the crack, using HPDE material (old bleach bottles, etc.) as a filler.  The following is a good instructable, using a soldering iron:

http://www.instructables.com/id/Repair-Plastic-Fuel-Tank/

One thing he doesn't include is the need to "stop drill" the crack at both ends.  Just drill an 1/8th inch hole at each end of the crack to prevent it from going further.

Hope this helps, and let us know how it turns out. As I said it is going to be an ongoing issue with these cars and any tanks we find in the junk yards are also going to have the same issues so we are going to have to learn how to repair them.

Bill
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lamune

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 1:28 am

Don't discount the plastic welding idea. Unlike my success rate with the shop press, my success rate with the plastic welder has been very high. I fixed 2 pieces of interior trim with the thing and it more than paid for itself- those parts are hard to find.

I'm using this thing:

https://www.harborfreight.com/plastic-welding-kit-with-air-motor-and-temperature-adjustment-96712.html

It's basically a heat gun with a very small tip. They sell plastic welding rods that include polypropylene there too. It's not hard to do and it'll likely hold up if you do what C2D says and drill out the crack endpoints.

They also sell a soldering-iron-like plastic welder but I find the hot air one works better for me.
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Glide-Aways



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:02 am

Texas Mike:  Thank you so much for talking me off that ledge and for the encouraging words.  I took your advice and called a couple of those salvage yards.  True to their word, they "believed" they have a tank for me.  New challenge is shipping one; due to they're being used they are now considered hazardous materials.  I've learned this means shipping to a residence is hundreds of dollars more, so I'm looking to see if I can ship one to my mechanic directly.

Highland Auto however found a salvage yard here in CA.  So I called them and spoke to a very helpful young lady who offered to send me photos and "inspect" the tank for its condition.  She said it has no cracks and is in good condition.  It appears to have come from a Roadmaster, but the location of the feeder tube has be wondering if this really came from a sedan..?

Does anyone know what these look like "naked?" Is this really the right tank for wagons such as ours?





If this is the right tank, it's within reach for me to go get it myself (about 500 miles round trip).

Thanks again everyone for your advice!
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:19 am

That is a sedan tank. The wagon tank has the hose on the left side, and the access is more centered.


Last edited by Fred Kiehl on Thu May 11, 2017 10:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:31 am

Yep, sedan tank, but don't give up. With all the cars in California I'm SURE you can find a tank at a Mom and Pop yard. You want one where the filler neck is on the side, not in the middle. Sedans have the filler neck behind the license plate, wagons as you know have them on side.

Again though, don't give up. I have a friend that LOVES salvage yarding in California because your stuff never rusts, and he says there are hundreds of cars.

Don't give up.

-Mike
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:39 am

Glide-Aways, a LOT of folks have moved over to the Facebook wagon pages. This forum is fantastic, but due to ease of uploading pics and accessing pages, the Facebook groups have really grown. If I were you, I would join the most-popular ones and ask members there if they have the tank. There are many wagon folks in California, and I'd be shocked if someone didn't have a parts wagon or stash to help you out.

Here are the main pages I know of.
B-Body Wagon Mafia - https://www.facebook.com/groups/212237968960856/
Buick Roadmaster 91-96 - https://www.facebook.com/groups/688532847832552/
Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon 1991 through 1996 - https://www.facebook.com/groups/260474664139172/
Impalas & Caprices All GM B-Body - https://www.facebook.com/groups/125602167525421/

You have LOTS of good resources out there.

-Mike
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:40 am

You may be able to ship one by Greyhound. They ship a lot of car parts. Just make sure it is washed out, and sealed, so it does not emit odors. I would also box it, because they do not look in the box.

I made a composite picture of a wagon tank, but it will not load. Send me your email, and I will attach it.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:47 am

Thanks Mike and Fred, I was afraid of that. With availability and shipping challenges, my only chances seem to be to find one here in CA. Search resumes!

Matt
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:49 am

Wow, thanks again Mike! I'll checkout those FB groups next.Thanks for keeping my hope alive!
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:52 am

Good ideas Fred, thanks! I just pm'd you with my email address.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 3:21 pm

I paid about 125 for one about 3 years ago just an price point. At the time I thought it was a little high, but I sorta owed the seller a favor, so I didn't argue the price.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 5:49 pm

When O'Rielly thought they had my tank they quoted me $225. I later confirmed they did not have the right tank either.
I'm still looking/calling, but as of now still no tank. I have until the end of June to find one. Then I'll be forced to sell the wagon. Also have some more research to do to see if someone can repair it.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:33 pm

Glide-Aways wrote:
When O'Rielly thought they had my tank they quoted me $225. I later confirmed they did not have the right tank either.
I'm still looking/calling, but as of now still no tank. I have until the end of June to find one. Then I'll be forced to sell the wagon. Also have some more research to do to see if someone can repair it.

You can fix it my way if you like,
Drop the tank scuff up either side of the crack with a grinder, mix up some fiberglass resin and pour it on
Let it dry/harden, bolt  the tank back in.

I did this to my pickup tank 3 years ago its still not leaking, its a crack up on top only affected when tank is full, only slosh and vapours after that, no pressure to seal.

Seems dramatic to me to sell a car because it needs a fuel tank,
Especially with the internet to find used parts.
If you google Gas tank repair kit/sealer etc u get a lot of choices
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Thu May 11, 2017 10:50 pm

CA smog test pressurizes the fuel system to check for any possible leaks, anywhere in the entire system. That test only started a few years ago and caught almost ALL Ford Ranger owners with split plastic vent/fill tubes that needed to be replaced at nearly $200 a pop.

Keep an eye out at the auction lots in Anaheim and Orange County that have donated cars or cars from CoPart that they sell very cheap. You can find them on ebay with a vast selection of cars, only a couple months ago they had a 91-95 wagon that went for less than $500.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Fri May 12, 2017 11:33 am

just me wrote:
CA smog test pressurizes the fuel system to check for any possible leaks, anywhere in the entire system. That test only started a few years ago and caught almost ALL Ford Ranger owners with split plastic vent/fill tubes that needed to be replaced at nearly $200 a pop.

Keep an eye out at the auction lots in Anaheim and Orange County that have donated cars or cars from CoPart that they sell very cheap. You can find them on ebay with a vast selection of cars, only a couple months ago they had a 91-95 wagon that went for less than $500.

It's amazing to me how insane the laws and regulations are out there.... scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Fri May 12, 2017 12:02 pm

Yeah...this is only my second non-exempt car I've purchased and it's proving to be a hard learning experience. I get the whole environmental thing...and in some ways I'm thankful - for safety reasons - that the crack was found...but CA really makes it hard for folks like us who like older cars.

Phantom: I agree the prospect of selling the wagon over this seems dramatic, but without a remedy to this tank thing I won't be able to register it. I'm on a temporary registration that is good for 30 days with only one 30 day extension allowed. That takes me to June 30th. After that I'll just have a couch that seats 8 in my garage...something for which I have no use.

I still have a few calls to make on tank replacement and tank repair options. For the repair route, I'm going to call some RV repair shops; maybe they are more accustomed to repairing plastic tanks..? So far, no conventional auto repair shops around here are willing to do this (and I do not have the means for doing this type of work myself). Fingers still crossed!
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Fri May 12, 2017 12:17 pm

Glide-Aways wrote:
Yeah...this is only my second non-exempt car I've purchased and it's proving to be a hard learning experience.  I get the whole environmental thing...and in some ways I'm thankful - for safety reasons - that the crack was found...but CA really makes it hard for folks like us who like older cars.  

Phantom:  I agree the prospect of selling the wagon over this seems dramatic, but without a remedy to this tank thing I won't be able to register it. I'm on a temporary registration that is good for 30 days with only one 30 day extension allowed. That takes me to June 30th.  After that I'll just have a couch that seats 8 in my garage...something for which I have no use.  

I still have a few calls to make on tank replacement and tank repair options. For the repair route, I'm going to call some RV repair shops; maybe they are more accustomed to repairing plastic tanks..?  So far, no conventional auto repair shops around here are willing to do this (and I do not have the means for doing this type of work myself).  Fingers still crossed!

It is NOT rocket-science to lower down a gas tank. If it's between selling you car or spending a weekend fixing it yourself, I would recommend getting the floor jack and stands out, and putting some Bud on ice. It's all part of the joy of owning an older car. And you feel a good sense of accomplishment when you fix it yourself too. I can think of worse ways to spend a weekend. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Fri May 12, 2017 12:20 pm

https://www.partshotlines.com/component/phl/search/

17 hits on 91-96 wagon fuel tank.....
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Join date : 2011-05-22
Location : California

PostSubject: Re: Fuel tank?   Fri May 12, 2017 12:24 pm

Sprocket wrote:
https://www.partshotlines.com/component/phl/search/

17 hits on 91-96 wagon fuel tank.....

Yes! That's the list I'm working lol. And I have a couple more that Mike mentioned too. Thank you!
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Fuel tank?
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