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Dr.Oldsmobile



Posts : 48
Join date : 2016-06-07
Location : Wichita, KS

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PostSubject: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeTue Sep 06, 2016 4:38 pm

Anyone ever have any luck fitting headers to an Olds powered B-body?  I'd really like to ditch the crossover arrangement and go to true dual exhaust, and maybe shed some pounds of cast iron while I'm at it.  Even shorties I'm fine with.  Seems like headers that fit a smaller G-body should work, but you never know.

In other Olds header installations, I've read that clearing the starter is usually an issue, but I'm already planning to use a smaller/lighter starter.  

I'm just not really excited to drop $500 or more on an experiment only to find out they don't fit...
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MalibuSSwagon



Posts : 580
Join date : 2014-01-12
Location : NH

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 8:35 am

Usually people buy Chevelle headers 68-72 for SBC B-bodies and those fit, maybe the same for the Cutlass? Amazon has a great return policy if you can buy them there. Or try Summit, Jegs.
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Fred Kiehl

Fred Kiehl

Posts : 5805
Join date : 2009-11-13
Age : 72
Location : Largo, FL 33774

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 9:06 am

Shorty headers work fine. The Chevelle headers will work fine (do not mount the O2 sensor bung on the bottom or outside of the header...it must be within 90 degrees of vertical from the top). You need a few mods to install the duals. Make a hump in the trans crossmember. You can find a muffler hanger from the right side of a JY car.,.the holes are already in the frame to mount it mirror image to the passenger's side. If you have ALC, you will either have to eliminate it, or get a unit from a 94-96, and install it (driver's side muffler goes there). You need to put a heat shield around driver's side of the fuel tank, or on the exhaust pipe. If you are going to dump it in front of the axle, you can eliminate the shielding issue. Put a heat shield under the floor of the driver's side of the foot wells. You may want to relieve the floor on the driver's side, because the pipe will be very close to the floor, or stick out below the frame under the rear seat footwell. You will also need a heat shield at the brake lines beside the header, and the wiring on the frame at the transmission linkage pivot. Make sure the exhaust pipe clears the transmission linkage pivoting arm when it is in 1st gear. Reposition the oil pressure sender to point rearwards parallel to the trans. Make an extension for the O2 wire to the sensor from an old sensor, and a pigtail from a wiring harness (use a crimp connector because the wire is stainless, and will not solder). You can get another of the wiring clamp brackets from along the oil pan rail to control the wire extension, so that it does not contact the header (use the last oil pan bolt on the side to hold the bracket).
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phantom 309

phantom 309

Posts : 5824
Join date : 2008-12-28
Age : 111

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 9:25 am

I think the 68-72 cutlass headers would be a drop in on an olds powered wagon,.

I have modified a couple of sets of headers over the years, ranging from a couple of whacks with a hammer on a tube,. to cutting a 1/2" out of a lower frame rail,.. to cutting heating bending and adding a piece of tubing to another set,.all depends on your skill and comfort level modifying stuff,.
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Dr.Oldsmobile



Posts : 48
Join date : 2016-06-07
Location : Wichita, KS

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 9:38 am

Thanks, Fred.  That's a lot of good info.  These are the headers I've been eyeballing:

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hed-58166/overview/make/oldsmobile

Is the 94-96 ALC unit significantly different/better, or is it just the fact that they are typically cheap enough that it's not worth taking the time to fab brackets to relocate it?

Phantom, I'd rather not get involved in structural modifications. I don't mind fabricating brackets, heat shields, or wire harnesses, and I'm mostly okay with minor pounding on some underside sheetmetal to make room, but the two things I'd really rather avoid is modifying the frame rails or marring up a brand new set of ceramic coated long tube headers. I'll take a slight hit and go with shortys and let my guy at the muffler shop make the pipes fit the car.
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phantom 309

phantom 309

Posts : 5824
Join date : 2008-12-28
Age : 111

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 10:16 am

Dr.Oldsmobile wrote:


Phantom, I'd rather not get involved in structural modifications.   I'd really rather avoid modifying the frame rails or marring up a brand new set of ceramic coated long tube headers. .

Thats fair enough,.a motivated install, might involve fitting the headers, modifying things as necessary, then having the headers coated afterwards,.

Well prepped and painted headers are easy to touch up and keep looking good,. cheaper too for a daily driver,.

Close up the centre divider on the centre siamese ports on any header install with an olds,.
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Dr.Oldsmobile



Posts : 48
Join date : 2016-06-07
Location : Wichita, KS

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 11:46 am

phantom 309 wrote:


Well prepped and painted headers are easy to touch up and keep looking good,. cheaper too for a daily driver,.

Close up the centre divider on the centre siamese ports on any header install with an olds,.

This will be my first adventure with steel; all of my experience is with cast or stainless.  I'm a bit skeptical of paint on headers, but the shortys are $241 cheaper if I finish them myself.  I figured ceramic would be better for a daily driver, but I'm open to suggestions.

I'm installing a 1970 350 with the original #6 heads.  I know some people build those center dividers out to the gasket surface, but I'm inclined to leave it alone for now.  I'm also considering exhaust flow plates from Dick Miller.  

I'm not sure if I'll put W-31 valves in it or not.  If I don't need extensive machine work done, I'll probably leave them stock.  I    am finally in possession of the gold motor, but won't have time to tear it down to see what I've got until mid-October.
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Andebe

Andebe

Posts : 3323
Join date : 2013-02-20
Age : 51
Location : Marion,NC

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 4:09 pm

Loving all the REO goodies...Real Headers 11148512_913300685357893_3989826334029233351_n
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Fred Kiehl

Fred Kiehl

Posts : 5805
Join date : 2009-11-13
Age : 72
Location : Largo, FL 33774

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeWed Sep 07, 2016 4:39 pm

I believe the headers you are considering will fit without mods except for adding an O2 sensor bung. I added my O2 sensor to the reducer instead of the header itself. I needed a little longer wire extension, but it works fine, and did not require that I modify the header. If you are going to do the ceramic coating yourself, where you put the O2 bung does not matter (see above location), as long as you weld it on before you coat them. You only need one on the DS header. Ceramic coating will keep your under hood temps down, and your wiring will last a lot longer. I wrapped mine with header wrap, and had plenty of room around them. With all the negative press about wrap on steel headers, I have not experienced any deterioration. If you are going to wrap them, stainless steel would ensure that you would not have any issues. Either way, it keeps heat out of the engine compartment, and that is a good thing.

The 94-96 ALC pump is located on the front DS frame rail behind the bumper cover. It is for the most part, ready to install with bracket and hoses. You only need to redirect and lengthen the wires and hoses to reach the motor unit. You could pull the air lines from a 94-96 as well, because they will fit correctly. The wires from the sensor should also be usable, so you will need to splice the rest. I believe the old harness exits the body under the rear seat, so you will need some wire from there to the compressor at the front. You could tap into your body harness at the A pillar, and make a new hole in the firewall with a grommet to run the wires front. The wire harness for most DS front mounted parts exits the passenger compartment behind the fender. Color coding is probably the same. Installing the mount to the frame requires drilling some holes. You may have to thread them, but a taper threaded screw (grab the one(s) from the junk yard) and an impact wrench or high torque drill will install it with ease...no tap to break. Measure the location of the holes on the donor for proper location.
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occ6.6



Posts : 54
Join date : 2016-01-05

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PostSubject: Re: Real Headers   Real Headers Icon_minitimeSat Dec 17, 2016 6:47 pm

I used sanderson # 0351 headers on my wifes 455 powered 89 caprice. right side is tight to brake line to rf wheel & had to trim 1/4 " off upper control arm mount bolts but all was good then. left side just touched steering coupler , shifted column a little bit & done. you wont have those issues with a small block olds. I used the same headers on the 403 in my 92 occ fit mint no mods or tweaks required
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