Datalogging o2 for tuning

Hey guys! The sleeperwagon is almost back together, and the stroker should be on the dyno within a week or so. I have a question or two about tuning and datalogging.-

1- Before the car got parked, I put an Innovate Motorsports LC-1 wideband O2 controller and gauge in the car. Because it was the gauge kit and not the datalogging kit, it did not come with the adapter cable for plugging into a laptop. The cable is still available (3746), but has a com port connector rather than a USB. I haven't seen a laptop with a DB9 port in years.

2- I have downloaded the EEhacks software, Tunerpro, and all the other recommendations onto my laptop, and I have the ALDL cable that came with my Tunercats software 6 or 7 years ago. Unfortunately that laptop bricked, so I don't have Tunercat any more.

3- Engine is severely modified. I am copy-pasting Sherlock's checklist below, and added the rest of the mods thereafter:

Sherlock's list from his tuning post, answers bold in parentheses-
0. Ignition system (ICM, coil, optispark, coil wire, plug wires, plugs) in good working condition, plugs are correct heat range for the motor. (all brand new. Plugs are 2 heat ranges cooler due to nitrous system)
1. Injectors in good working order. (brand new Accel 42lb/hr)
2. Fuel pump operating at spec pressures across the load spectrum. (new pump going in this weekend. Nitrous system has its own fuel supply sys)
3. MAF is clean, screened, and reading properly. (F-body MAF installed)
4. Intake tract is in its final state and not about to be changed (makes a HUGE difference in part-throttle and idle tuning. (Home Depot w swiss cheese airbox)
5. All exhaust manifold bolts intact, no broken bolts or gasket leaks. (Afterburner headers, all new gaskets)
6. O2 sensors working properly. (both OEM o2s and the Innovate wideband are new or nearly new)
7. Knock sensors working properly. (stock '94 knock sensors, new)
8. Cooling system functioning properly. (Flushed, new 180 thermostat)
9. Other sensors (TPS, coolant, MAP) functioning properly. (all were in good working order when engine was pulled, can replace in needed)
10. Powertrain is not hitting the suspension or frame (this often causes false knock). (new t-56, but everything is clearanced that I know of)
11. Exhaust in final form and not about to be modified. (3"x-pipe into dual 2.5in magnaflows)
12. PCV system operating properly. (yes, new PCV, new vac lines)
13. EGR operating properly (ideal) or properly blocked off. (internally blocked and sealed but left on the car for sleeper purposes)
14. Transmission mechanical health ok (above 175psi at top of 1st gear at WOT). (newly built t-56 with Centerforce DF clutch)
15. Consistent quality fuel available. I've seen tunes vary 10% from tank of gas to tank of gas due to ethanol content fluctuations (there's a reason they say "UP TO 10% ethanol"). (Almost all the fuel stations in our small town get their fuel off the same truck, so as long as I go to the same station so additives are the same, should be good)


I know I read somewhere that I can run the wideband O2 signal to an unused pin on the ECM (#27 comes to mind, iirc) and then datalog on the laptop so I have a concurrent tach signal, but I am not sure if that works with the Innovate LC-1. I talked to them and they said the LC-1 is no longer supported or repaired, but should work for what I want, as the brown output wire is an analog wideband signal. If I piggyback that signal to the ECM, then I theoretically don't need the com port adapter cable, correct? (since the laptop will be receiving all info through the ECM at the ALDL cable). If the LC-1 isn't the right tool for the job, what other choices are out there? I think Sherlock mentioned a couple other wideband sensors that can be wired to the ECM, but didn't find the specifics. Seems like someone said that certain wideband sensors wired to the ECM and give a useable tuning signal directly to the EEHacks datalogger. I know a lot of this info may be over on the ImpalaSS forum, but I put in a join request almost 3 months ago now and got ignored. Can't find specific answers with search, and can't message members there unless you are also a member. Kinda frustrated.

Engine specs-

383CI, 11.5-1 compr, ported heads and intake, 1.6 rollers, ZZ409 cam, 54mm TB. Direct port wet nitrous, separate low-pressure fuel system with nitrous cutoff switch tied to fuel pressure, so EFI fuel supply is unaffected by nitrous use. Currently set for 250hp shot, will ramp up as testing allows.



The TPIS guys want almost $600 bucks for a baseline tune based on my mods. I would like to be able to make my own tune to get it running, then datalog on the engine dyno to fine-tune using wideband o2 and EGT sensors rather than spend all that money for a tune I am going to modify in less than a week. Is that realistic? I have ordered ALL the EFI tuning books on Amazon, and they are supposed to trickle in over the next several days. I am a voracious reader, so I imagine I will have them all read within a week.

Any other helpful info or direction I am missing here? Appreciate your help!

$600 for a baseline tune? Dang I need to quit my day job.

I'm gonna reply in my usual numbered list format to keep my thoughts organized:

1. Send me a PM about the Impala SS forum and I'll see about getting you going. I'm an admin over there so I should be able to help.
   
2. If you contact TunerCat he can send you the info you need for the latest TunerCat download, since you already bought it.  His customer service during business hours is very good.  That said... I'm using TunerPro more and more.  Gearhead EFI's website has links to the latest file definitions with new stuff being discovered and fleshed out regularly.  
   
3. Use nothing but eehack to download and upload tunes.  Period.  End of story.  
   
4. As far as direct wideband support, go browse around on [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and you'll find more info.  I have two non-running cars at the moment but hopefully this fall I'll get back into all that.  Yes, wire it directly to the PCM as you'll want to use eehack on the ALDL port to datalog.  I strongly recommend buying a good USB to TTL cable and hard-wiring it to the back of the ALDL port to avoid any connector issues while tuning.
   
5. Send me a PM about tuning and I can walk you through setting up a baseline tune. If you still have the stock MAF and intake setup including resonators (no worries on the swiss cheese airbox), you might consider putting that on for the short term while you tune part throttle on the stock O2 sensors. Getting a starting tune setup is about managing unknown variables, and right now your big unknowns are your MAF table (F body MAF in a modified B body piping setup), injectors (unless you have known-good short pulse adder and voltage offset tables), and the gains/delays necessary for the new locations of the O2 sensor relative to stock.  So best to temporarily take out variables until you can get everything defined, then add the new variables back in one at a time.  The intake system is the easiest to put back to stock so you have a known-good airflow measurement system. Think of your PCM as a computer that requires good inputs to generate good outputs. So make sure your inputs (MAF / VE, fuel injector characterization, O2 data) are all known good, and it makes tuning 100x easier.
   
6. Getting this car running won't be nearly as hard as you think.  I still can't believe they quoted $600.
   

$600 is insane. PCM Performance does it for a couple hundred and gives a big discount if you have a way to upload the tune yourself.

Thanks for the help. Yeah I was pretty shocked about the price too. They have a tiered pricing structure for tunes based on the number and type of mods you have. My car has pretty much every single mod in their list, and then adding nitrous pushed it up from there. Here is the page with their pricing schedule. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Mine is a Level 5, which is $575 :O

PM sent, appreciate the replies!

sherlock9c1 wrote:

$600 for a baseline tune? Dang I need to quit my day job.

I'm gonna reply in my usual numbered list format to keep my thoughts organized:

1. Send me a PM about the Impala SS forum and I'll see about getting you going. I'm an admin over there so I should be able to help.
   
2. If you contact TunerCat he can send you the info you need for the latest TunerCat download, since you already bought it.  His customer service during business hours is very good.  That said... I'm using TunerPro more and more.  Gearhead EFI's website has links to the latest file definitions with new stuff being discovered and fleshed out regularly.  
   
3. Use nothing but eehack to download and upload tunes.  Period.  End of story.  
   
4. As far as direct wideband support, go browse around on [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and you'll find more info.  I have two non-running cars at the moment but hopefully this fall I'll get back into all that.  Yes, wire it directly to the PCM as you'll want to use eehack on the ALDL port to datalog.  I strongly recommend buying a good USB to TTL cable and hard-wiring it to the back of the ALDL port to avoid any connector issues while tuning.
   
5. Send me a PM about tuning and I can walk you through setting up a baseline tune. If you still have the stock MAF and intake setup including resonators (no worries on the swiss cheese airbox), you might consider putting that on for the short term while you tune part throttle on the stock O2 sensors. Getting a starting tune setup is about managing unknown variables, and right now your big unknowns are your MAF table (F body MAF in a modified B body piping setup), injectors (unless you have known-good short pulse adder and voltage offset tables), and the gains/delays necessary for the new locations of the O2 sensor relative to stock.  So best to temporarily take out variables until you can get everything defined, then add the new variables back in one at a time.  The intake system is the easiest to put back to stock so you have a known-good airflow measurement system.  Think of your PCM as a computer that requires good inputs to generate good outputs. So make sure your inputs (MAF / VE, fuel injector characterization, O2 data) are all known good, and it makes tuning 100x easier.
   
6. Getting this car running won't be nearly as hard as you think.  I still can't believe they quoted $600.