Rear wheel bearing?

I have a "whoop, whoop, whoop" starting at about 20mph and increases to a hum at speed. Thought it was brakes, but replaced everything including turning the drums. No change. Now I think it's the bearing. Dif fluid is full. 15K on the oil since last change with Felpro gasket with holes. I have always been told that unless there is oil leaking, don't change the bearings so, how do I know if the bearing is shot? How difficult is it to replace? Haynes says that I need a rear bearing puller with a slide handle, but I have a screwdriver and hammer....will that work?

Once again, Haynes got it wrong. This is a full floating axle. You need to pull the cover off, remove the center shaft from the spider, push both axles in to expose the "C" rings and remove them. The shafts will now pull straight out.

The bearings use the axle itself as the inner race, so any wear on the axle either requires a new axle shaft or one of the "problem solver" bearngs (essentially an offset bearing that uses a different part of the shaft to ride on). Once the axle is out, its easy to check the bearing. If it turns smooth and shows no sign of damage your probably all right. The axle shaft is the weak link. It usually shows wear first.

Bill

convert2diesel wrote:

The axle shaft is the weak link. It usually shows wear first.

Bill

which should cause leaks, right?

How many miles are on your car. Mine got axles at 238K. They were leaking a lot.

It could be the ring an pinion as well. How long has this been acting up?

The FSM shows a type of slide hammer which can get behind the bearing to remove it. They use a tool which only contacts the outer race of the bearing to install the new one. They suggest being careful when inserting the new axle so that you do not damage the new bearing. The rest of the above is correct. I have not heard of many people happy with the problem solver bearings. NAPA has new axle kits for about $150/side. They include the bearing and seal, but not a cover gasket.

the car has 141K on the clock and has had the fluid changed every 25Kfor the past 75K. been making noise for about 6 weeks.

I had a bad axle on my 94 9C1. It didn't make noise, and there was no leak. Only found it when I had the brakes apart one day and noticed how much play there was in the axle to the tube.

there was some "slop" in the axle. More in/out than side to side, but there was play side to side. Any idea what the acceptable play is?

Krzdimond wrote:

there was some "slop" in the axle. More in/out than side to side, but there was play side to side. Any idea what the acceptable play is?

"Measured in thous" If you have any noticible play (up and down/back and front), the bearings are bad (probably the axle shaft). When the bearing goes the first thing to take the hit is the axle shaft. Do it now and you might save the shaft. IIRMC there are oversize bearings available if you can get a machine shop to resurface the shaft. If not it's either a new shaft and bearing or one of the "problem solver" bearings I talked about earlier.

In and out is normal (about 1/8 - 1/4 inch)

Bill

I've been told the "repair bearings" are a waste of time.

You need one of these to remove the bearing from the axle housings

I've never used a repair bearing (I've heard they are temporary, at best). I put in a right side axle to replace my worn left. It seems the lefts go bad, and the rights are good...

jayoldschool wrote:

I've never used a repair bearing (I've heard they are temporary, at best). I put in a right side axle to replace my worn left. It seems the lefts go bad, and the rights are good...

Jay:

Depends on the axle. If the shaft hasn't lost its temper, they work fine using another area of the shaft as the inner race. All the problem solver does, is re-locate the where the bearing is located in the housing. If the axle was a mess to start with, nothings going to work other then a new shaft. I have had one re-machined and case hardened, when I couldn't find a new replacement on an older boxy Cadillac, then installed an oversize bearing to make up the difference but the ideal fix is a good replacement axle and a stock bearing.

Robert is going to have to pull the axle to find out what he needs. There should be enough axles out there if he needs one, we should be able to find one for him. Rock Auto lists a Dorman kit (630118) including the bearings and seals for around $120.00. Hopefully his axle is fine and he can get by with a new bearing.

Bill

going to pull the axles tomorrow and check. Any idea what the min tolerance is for the axle? autozone has replacement axle shafts with bearing and seals for $135, and just the bearing for $45. Would rather do just the bearings on a financial standpoint alone, but will replace the complete shaft if it is recommended. Also, are the rear bearings like the fronts; replace in pairs?


I have the posi and have been told to ONLY get the friction modifier from the dealer. Is there another option out there? (Dealer is closed for the day and I think parts is closed to the public on Sat.) I can't find anything about how much posi fluid to add anywhere and can't remember how much I added last time fluid was changed

Only modifier I have ever had work properly was the GM stuff.

My Autozone only charged me 12 plus tax for Timken bearings.

Krzdimond wrote:

going to pull the axles tomorrow and check. Any idea what the min tolerance is for the axle? autozone has replacement axle shafts with bearing and seals for $135, and just the bearing for $45. Would rather do just the bearings on a financial standpoint alone, but will replace the complete shaft if it is recommended. Also, are the rear bearings like the fronts; replace in pairs?

Only enough clearance to allow the bearing to rotate freely. If the shaft is worn, it will be more then evident. Will have a nice groove where the bearings interact with the shaft. If the depth is more then 3 thou (if you can feel the ridge with your fingernail) then its new axle time. Rear bearings are not considered a maintenance item. They don't experience the same side loads as the tapered bearings in the front (assuming you don't autocross with the car). If the other bearing seems fine, it probably is. They have to be pretty worn to start howling. You might consider it though as it looks like you will be loading up the axle with the trailer weight. You have the rear end apart, have the slide hammer to pull the bearing, might as well replace both while your at it.

Bill

JUST checked the website (Autozone) and the bearing I held yesterday is the "repair" bearing for $45. Stock bearing is $13)

Had a thought while trying to get to sleep last night...... What if the axle itself is bent, or the plate that the wheel bolts to is bent....... For my sanity, I'll be playing with math this afternoon

Parts counter at the Chevy dealership is closed on weekends. Any suitable additives out there? I saw - and don't trust- a jug of gear oil with the additive already added. Royal Purple?

I've used the limited slip additive that Autozone sells separately and have not had a problem. The Royal Purple is good oil by all accounts I've heard and will probably work just fine, but I'm not sure it's worth the extra cost. Have at it, it's not that bad of a job.

Raised the car and ran it off the ground. Uploading a video now to youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn6XiYNYQhI The video sucks, but I had to convert it TWICE just to get it to load.

As Y'all probably figured out by now, i am REALLY not looking forward to breaking the seal on this diff.

While i have been infamous for "creative engineering" and mult-purposing tools, I only want to do things right the first time these days.

video loaded!!

Hard to tell in the video what has more play in it, the wheel, or the camera. Side to side,

up and down, there shouldn't be much if any play. In and out, 1/8" may be 1/4". What about

pinion play, any there? Should be thousandths if any, other than that, you gotta go in and get

the axles out. Get a few drain buckets, cardboard, and a bunch of rags so you don't stain that

nice driveway of yours!

Mike

there is about 1/4" play in the wheel when rotating (pinion?), 1/8" in and out and the drivers side has no lateral play while the passenger side has a "little". Enough to see. I am going to pull the shafts out tomorrow after work and do a visual.
In 30 years of playing with cars, I have never pulled an axle shaft or rear bearings so I don't know what "right" looks like.
Worst case is that i need a new axle shaft.

"Right" looks shiny where the bearing rides the axle. Wrong is a groove. It will be obvious.

I don't get what your saying about 1/4" play at the wheel when turning the pinion.

I don't think you should be able to "see" the lateral (front to back) movement of the wheel, just "feel" it.

Mike

Take a look at this, it may help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqdmUPWpI9c&feature=related

My own tips:

1. You will not have to remove the spider gears to remove the axles.

2. Use a telescoping magnet (Like a power antenna mast) to retrieve the C clips from the axle groove and to slide them back in.

Mike

On the video, it sounds exactly like my old Ford truck when it had a bad bearing/axle.

OK, just pulled the diff cover off and found a BUNCH of little wire.Looks like it was part of a weak spring

Anyway, the book (Haynes) says to pull out the pinion shaft to gain access to the c clips. Pics in the book show a peg leg and I have the posi. That pin is IN THERE! Had to beat on it with a hammer and brass drift to get it to move. It is so tight that I got thinking....... Maybe I shouldn't be doing this.....

So, here's the question: Do I HAVE to remove this pin, or is it just a good idea to make room to remove the retaining clips? Or do i put the locking bolt back in and just remove the clips?

The pinion shaft has to come out, as it keeps the axles from sliding in and the c clips from

falling out and the axles walking right out of the housing. Although the wagons skirts will

hold the wheel/tire/axle assembly in for a short time. And yes it takes a little more effort with the

limited slip. The spring parts you found in there isn't a good thing so I suppose you may

have more difficulty getting the shaft out, and back in for that matter. Start saving your

money for a new LSD. If you have the factory diff still there are 2 access "windows" in the

case. One is obstructed by the coil springs while the other side is open with only 2 springs

showing, the later being the access "window" (second picture).

https://2img.net/h/i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad350/mlawrenz/32810004.jpg

https://2img.net/h/i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad350/mlawrenz/32810003.jpg

Everything else is the same.

Cool, thanks. Was concerned that the pin was holding the springs in and when I removed the pin, the springs would come flying out.

On a side note: Guess what I forgot to do on the last oil change??






Yup, I forgot to notch the gasket. Well, at least I know why it's making noise.

Why after all these years have the gasket makers not corrected this? Every one I have bought over the years suffers from the same thing. Doesn't seem like quantum physics to me to change the dies to match up to the holes. Just did mine last weekend, bought the Felpro gasket and sure enough, had to notch out the gasket.

Bill

all done and replaced. Passenger side is tighter than a gnats ass, but the drivers side is no change. It'll take a couple of days to get the new axle shaft in, so I'll just see how it goes before I order one.

Why does he have to notch the gasket? I can see right from his pictures that the gasket wasn't covering those ports anyway.

Besides, those holes are for stretching the housing at the factory to more easily install the differential, not for fluid flow to the axle tubes. There should be enough room around the differential bearings to allow oil to flow down the tubes regardless of what's going on with the round holes. EDIT - there's nothing wrong with having oil through those side holes but it's not a requirement for lube.

Robert, I have a spare used wagon axle here that's in perfect shape if you end up needing one, for cheaper than a new one. Send me a PM.

I agree with the holes on the gasket. Placed the new one over the old one and the holes on the new gasket were free and clear.

Joel, you have PM

you should use silicone for a gasket,.it fits right everytime.

Nick

Yes, but then you have to wait for it to dry. With a gasket, you torque it down and it's ready for fluid.