Lower Ball Joint?

My brother replaced the lower control arm on his Limited Wagon because the bearings were shot. It immediately became obvious that something was wrong at the new lower ball joint. We assumed it was bad and got another one. Same thing. Just looked at it now and it's clear that the ball joint is flopping around in the spindle. Does the wagon take a bigger ball joint? None of the parts sites seem to indicate this. Rock Auto does sell what they call an "oversize" ball joint. Is this what we need?

Thanks for posting Jim. By bearings you mean bushings, right?

The Betty needed lower control arm bushings. Rather than go through the trouble of ordering bushings and having to press them in and out, I decided just to order the whole control arm since it was cheap enough. It came complete with a new lower ball joint.

That's the problem, It appears the lower ball joint that came on my new control arm is the wrong size. It bottoms out when I tighten it in the spindle and the wheel is loose.

Sorry to repeat Jim's OP but I'm wondering if there is a different size ball joint for the Estate Wagon then on the regular Roadmaster. I called Advance Auto (where I bought it) and they don't list a different ball joint for the wagon. Also, are the control arms the same?

Thanks, Mike

Control arm and ball joint should be the same for all bbodys except 9c1.

Perhaps he bought a 9C1 5/8th ball joint arm?

OK. Thanks. Not sure what's wrong. Something is defenit;ey not right. I'm going to take it to the local mechanic to see if he can sort it out.

Is the 9C1 5/8" balljoint bigger or smaller than a "regular" balljoint? On the Caddies, the commercial chassis has a bigger cone/taper on the stud so the hole in the spindle is obviously bigger. I was thinking that's what's going on here.

One control arm was from Advance Auto, the other is a Delco from Rock Auto. Both have the same issue - stud on the balljoint appears to be too small.

Mike tossed the original control arm and balljoint so we can't compare.

EDIT: Found this tidbit on another forum:

"Late '95 into 96 9C1's got the 5/8" bll joints and the wagons didn't get them at all but I don't know about the 1A2 wagons. I think besides the 9C1's the only other B/D-body to get the 5/8" ball joint were the D-body Cadillac limos. So from '94 into a good part of '95 most B and D-bodies got the 9/16" ball joints and why I didn't say all because lik I said the limo D-bodies got the 5/8" ball joints."

Despite the fact that this person doesn't think the wagons came with the 5/8" balljoint, I'd bet Mike's wagon has them.

Mike: The lower control arm is different, too. I'd roll the dice on a 9C1 LCA.

After doing more research, I think the information I found regarding the LCA is incorrect. I'm 99% sure that the LCA on my limo is the same as "regular" Fleetwoods and I think the same is true of 9C1/1A2 Chevys (and in this Roadmaster wagon).

If you go to Rock Auto and try to get an LCA WITH a balljoint installed, it says "Exc. Police". But they don't list an LCA for the police package. But, if you go to Autozone or Adavance, there is no distinction between police and non-police for the LCAs they sell. This is because they DO NOT have a balljoint in them. This leads me to believe that they're the same except for the balljoint.

There IS a distinction on all catalogs between 9C1/1A2 and "regular" Caprices. Like jay said, the 9C1/1A2 has the 5/8" stud on the balljoint. "Regular" is 9/16. This explains the problem we're having. It does not explain, however, why this wagon has the commercial/public service/police front suspension on it. I guess it doesn't matter so long as we can get the right balljoint in it.

1A2 wagons have the same front suspension as civvie wagons,. no difference at all.

I,ve had some 1A2's,..

Nick

That's messed up. The sedans are different. That makes my brother's wagon even more strange.

Here's another thing: Autozone and Advance list "oversized" balljoints for the Roadmaster wagon. What does that mean?

Read: http://www.theherd.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=59

However if Nick says 1A2’s actually had 9/16” ball joints, then I would follow his lead before relying on the article.

Anyway - pay close attention to the part about the spindle taper:

“This is because if the tapered sleeve on the knuckle is damaged, the new joint will not be retained properly. The lower ball joint has a tapered stud which fits into a tapered hole in the steering knuckle. When overloaded, the stud separates from the knuckle and begins to wear both the stud and knuckle surfaces. Instead of a tight fit, they become loose, and even re-torqueing does not help.”

turbojimmy wrote:

If you go to Rock Auto and try to get an LCA WITH a balljoint installed, it says "Exc. Police". But they don't list an LCA for the police package. But, if you go to Autozone or Advance, there is no distinction between police and non-police for the LCAs they sell. This is because they DO NOT have a balljoint in them. This leads me to believe that they're the same except for the balljoint.

Nope. If it was that easy we would all have 5/8” balljoints installed our cars already – the 5/8” joint requires a different LCA with a larger diameter mounting boss.

Either someone did at one time swap out the factory 9/16” components for the 9C1 5/8” parts (possible, but remote) or the spindle is the 9/16” as the factory intended, but the taper is damaged and requires replacement (much more likely).

turbojimmy wrote:

Here's another thing: Autozone and Advance list "oversized" balljoints for the Roadmaster wagon. What does that mean?

It means the balljoint housing diameter that press fits into the LCA receiver is larger as the thin metal is easily stretched and can need the oversized housing to maintain a proper press fit in the arm.

- J

Thanks for the info JaySS. You're absolutely right (but you knew that :-)

We haven't solved it yet, but the only logical explanation is that the knuckle is bad. But it was fine before we replaced the LCA. We replaced the LCA because the bushings were bad, not the balljoint. The balljoint/knuckle wasn't loose. It was actually a total pain in the butt to separate.

Problem now is that the left knuckle is discontinued from GM.

I took it apart again today and it looks like the spindle is worn. I took a picture. It's shaped like an egg on the top and bottom. I'm guessing it's work the whole way though? Here's the picture:
https://2img.net/h/i1313.photobucket.com/albums/t555/TheBetty1/099_zps8513168b.jpg

So Mike replaced the knuckle (spindle) with a salvage yard part. It looked fine (not egg shaped). He also replaced the lower balljoint with a new one. IT'S DOING THE SAME FRIGGIN THING! Wheel wobbles at the balljoint.

What are we missing here. Mike is ready to set the thing on fire.

I figured it out. The nut on the ball joint wasn't tight. Seems fine now. I don't how this whole thing snowballed but I'm glad I finally got it resolved. I think it was a worn spindle.